What A Persona’S Tarot Deck Is?

A minor correction and addendum to the Tarot bit: You don’t need to have a matching Persona equipped, you just need to have it with you. While this is a small difference I think it opens up a different interpretation than the one you proposed: The Protagonist doesn’t need to change himself to match the Confidant he’s interacting with, but carrying with him a Persona matching the person he’s talking to grants him a better understanding of them, making it easier to help the Confidant work through their issues and reach their goals, the entire point of the Confidant storylines.

The ripping off the mask actually makes a great deal of sense. The persona for the main characters is their true feelings they bury, the actualization of their true self. By ripping off the mask, they accept their true unconscious self and it manifests as a persona. This is why Persona users can’t have shadows, as Morgana stated. It also really plays on the word Persona/Mask and it was a great design choice.

I had to correct the use of the Collective Unconscious. In the Persona series, the collective unconscious is represented by the velvet room, hence why it’s there you could summon demons, angels and gods from various mythologies and religions. It is the literal embodiment of the collective unconscious, the sum total of all symbolism in order to understand the natural world and phenomena around us. Also, it’s quite explicitly stated when you summon some Personas, they mention something along the lines of “I come for the sea of thy heart”, a metaphor for the collective unconscious. So yeah, I don’t think mementos was a appropriate example in this case.

being a long time persona fan it inspired me to literally dive into psychology, tarotology, and cognitive science, so i’m actually really happy everyone else is now finally getting on board the jung train. i will say though that playing persona 4 felt like it handled the idea of the shadow and anima/animus really well and better than persona 5

I love the article’s you do on psychology/philosophy although being an avid tolken fan I have to point out using odin and Gandolf as separate examples is redundant because the character of Gandolf is heavily influenced by Odin to the point of arguably being based off him. A small nitpick I know so keep making awesome articles!

Wonderful analysis as usual. I thought Get Even similarly and deftly portrayed the human condition, albeit in a way that completely turns story roles and exploration scenarios on their heads with its theme of identity and looping narrative. It’s one thing to contextualize the environment and in-game action, it’s another to do the same thing for the actual systems and mechanics governing the virtual space and gameplay rules.

I learned about Jung through Jordan Peterson’s podcast/videos, and I think this article did a great job of unpacking the super super dense info surrounding Jung’s mind theory. Prof. Peterson is absolutely brilliant but I, as a layman, have a lot of trouble following exactly what he means a lot of the time. So thanks EC!

Actually, the Tarot connections and inspirations run much deeper than that. Every Confidant starts with their life being in the upside down position of their arcana; But as you progress through the stories you help them change for the better and get their life in the upright position. Like for example Ryuji’s Arcana, The Chariot, in it’s upside down position means Aggression and being lost in life. Or Ann’s, The Lover, Means not knowing what to do and chasing after the wrong things.

Hmm, could you guys maybe do once a episode about how to properly do subtle hints? Like how to push an idea on the player, without them knowing, and getting them theorizing. Like, how to properly have a character with a split personality, but then how to properly push the player a bit in the right direction of theorizing, and trying to find deeper lore?

Excellent article as always, guys! As to what you said about not quite getting why the character take OFF their masks to use their Personas, I always thought it was to create the “weapons” needed to fight. The masks they wear and the code-names they use while in Palaces are in themselves a persona, a construct that they use to challenge those abusing power and to also protect their own identities. To summon their actual Persona, they accept their persona (Joker, Panther, Skull, etc.) and turn it into a weapon to fight society.

The “Mr. Edogawa’s TV Classroom” in the TV Listings menu of Persona 4: Golden also talks about Jungian psychology too if anyone has that and wants to know more. They slowly unlock as your play through it so they won’t all be there in the beginning but P4G’s a really good game too so it kinda like a bonus for players that’re interested in the subject. There 10 in all so there’s quite a bit there. If you’re a Persona 3 fan you also get to see Mr. Edogawa being Mr. Edogawa, which is always… fun? I think?

persona (mask) not only means how we utilise it to deal with the external world . we also tend to create a mask to deceit ourself . a mask that representing all the positive side of ourself . The mask make us feel that we are competence, but by doing so we have to bury our weaknesses into the shadow . what the game means by persona is that, we have to accept our shadow (weakness) to be fully aware about ourself . To do that, the main characters have to take off their old mask, recognise their shadow and create a new mask . something like recognise your weakness and reform your perception about yourself.

This reminds me of how one of my college professors was a big fan of Sigmund Freud. To her, Freud was the greatest psychoanalyst and no one else could compare to him, and she would pepper her own speech with Freud’s terms while seemingly denying anything that’s been refuted since. (She did not teach psychology, by the way. She just happens to be a hardcore fan of him.) Karl Jung was quite a sore spot for her…the easiest way to set her off for the whole day was mention his name.

I realize this is an older article, but I recently realized that the masks of persona 5 probably represent the masks/roles society forces on us. I mostly realized this because of Ryuji and his awakening. Ryuji was forced into the role of a delinquent by Kamoshida egging him on and then breaking his leg. His rebellion is accepting that mask and using it as Captain Kidd, but in a way it’s also his own form of redemption. Not that he did anything wrong, but it’s moreso him allowing himself to also step out of that forced on role and let his own true colors shine.

Persona games usually also form the main cast around character archetypes common in japanese fiction. There’s always the cool bro (Junpei, Yosuke, Ryuji), the hot tsundere (Yukari, Ann), the rich lady (Mitsuru, Yukiko, Haru) etc. You could most likely fit all the main cast of P3, P4, P5 under some archetypes common in anime. I’m sure that was a deliberate choice considering how they draw so much from Jungian psychology.

Persona 5 deviates a little from its Jungian roots compared to P2 and P3. In P3, you could “guess” the answers to SLinks by thinking of the character’s Arcana and answering to that effect (like Lovers and choices, Moon and illusion). One of the collective unsconscious aspects you didn’t mention that fascinates me is the demon-Personas and shadows, characters from all sorts of mythologies humans have thought up, appearing and disappearing in the cognitive world.

It’s worth noting too that in Persona 5, the tarot cards representing the social link characters are different from a normal tarot deck, they figures they show are defaced. For example, The Sun is drying the land with heat and has an evil grin in Persona 5 while in the classic tarot deck The Sun is shown nurturing the land. This happens with every card (minus The World). You could argue that, as in tarot every card has a positive and negative outcome, this deck is protraying the negative aspect of the cards instead of the positive aspect as is shown in a normal deck

The Final Pam fits eerily well as Judgement… shudders And great work to Dan Jones on coming up with all those inventive representations of the Major Arcana! (Good article, but I feel more allusions to P1-4 could benefit, especially seeing how 2 and especially 4 tackled Jung much more. Also, Mementos is essentially the public’s Palace (more accurate to the Shadow in traditional Jungian psychology), not the collective unconscious. Y’all should have played enough Persona to know that’s most likely the entire Metaverse /: Or the TV World, if you wanna be more accurate and go w/ P4)

Great analysis, just a minor correction: it’s not so wrong that, in P5, the characters tear their mask from them when they summon their personas, and it’s not so wrong either. When they tear they mask, they do so to make the mask transform in the summoned persona to let it use its skills and spells, meanwhile, when they wear the mask, they “adopt” the persona within themselves, getting all the stats boosts the persona gives to them when they equip it. And the MC actually “wears” countless masks on when he get a new persona, since when we get a new one it transforms in a mask and is “absorbed” by Joker’s mask, just like if it becomes part of the very same mask he is wearing. So, tearing the mask off is not wrong, is just like the MC is thinking “I don’t need to wear this mask right now, because is more important to show the world (or the enemy, in this case) the true face behind my persona, be it Arsène or a Pixie, and use its personal skills, than wear it and getting boosts for myself”. The same can be applied in real life when you notice that maybe, in dire situations, a person choose to not to wear a mask anymore in front a certain other person and show you true self, because is more profitable the truth instead of wearing a mask of deception just to be more easily accepted.

Something feel like the article did miss is the fact that the entire Major Arcana of the Tarot is actually telling a story. The story of the Fool’s journey – a repeating narrative of change and growth. The fact that the Major Arcana can be “reshuffled” means that whilst the elements of the story are the same, the order in which they occur differs for each individual.

Speaking as someone who got the Plat Trophy in this game, this is good stuff. I did watch it before I even played the game and I just re-watched it. Thanks Extra Credits~ Also, last trophy I got was negotiating for an ally’s life because they never got taken hostage until I deliberately set it up… I literally would never have known about the hostage thing without the trophy for it. zzzzzz

Just a note on the masks bit: the article implied that the act of ripping off the masks implied that the ripping the mask of summoned the persona, which I think is inaccurate. -The main protagonist gains new personas as masks and is able wear those masks to summon the persona’s. This implies that ripping the mask off allows the protagonist to wear new masks. The mask allows the summoning to occur. -The act of ripping of the mask is symbolic of the character rejecting their “false” persona (the mask they where prior to accepting their true nature as phantom thieves). That is why they have a new mask on after they transform rather than no mask at all. The masks act as direct symbols of the characters personas.

Nice article but there some things you mention don’t quiet add up, especially since they have a representation (???) in the series… The collective conscience is a place and it’s not mementos (mementos is the palace of the Tokyo) which you can see in the other titles (P3 for most) Really nice article I just don’t think it’s wise to limit it only to P5

Just an explanation for ripping off masks to summon personas – a common theme in the recent persona games is that personas are defined as a reflection of the summoner’s true self or the summoner’s inner psyche. So ripping off your mask/shooting yourself in the head/crushing a card all symbolize different ways to free your inner self from the chains or constraints you’ve placed around it as you grew up in society. (I forgot which psychologist wrote that theory. Might also be Jung) I guess you could say Personas are named after the method of summoning them (aka ripping your persona/s away to reveal a manifestation of your true self.) Or, if you take “persona” to mean “aspect of your self/personality”, the in-game Personas are the persona you hide to fit in with the rest of society. That’s why acquiring or evolving a persona involves “facing your true self”, or accepting/freeing the parts of you you hide/hide from. (Also why Shadows are closely related to Personas, which is only further emphasized in the Persona 5 game compared to 3 or 4.) This of course leads to all the interesting theories the fandom has on the Wild Cards and why they are capable of holding several Personas at once. Or, if you want to go with masks = Personas, then removing the mask allows it to change into the Persona. Lots of possible interpretations 😀

this is just my opinion (I could be right or wrong) but i think ripping of the mask is suppose to represent the breaking the system type of theme. Each persona game has its own theme p3 has the acceptance of death in p4 has being true to yourself and p5 has imprisonment so the fact that each said character wears the mask such as makoto carries pre-assumed responsibilities that he or she are shaped into. The ripping of the mask itself then comes down to as i said early breaking that cycle and breaking the chains of imprisonment that is under the mask. The persona series has always been really good at taking for strong meanings and symbolism into their games that is why I really like the persona series XD

That explanation of the shadow makes a lot more sense than persona 4’s explanation. Persona 4 essentially went off of “the opposite of how you present yourself is your true self” So say you don’t like work, well then in reality you’re actually a workaholic and you’re just suppressing that aspect of yourself for… whatever reason. And that just outright makes no sense. It was a broad sweeping statement that made way too many implications than it should have.

As for Mementos: it’s not really the same as the Jung’s collective uncouncious, which is the core of everyone’s mind. As you find out at the end of the game, it’s a collective Shadow created around a particular negative thought. As for tearing off the mask: the word Persona is actually used in the games in 2 very different meanings. First it’s the Jungian meaning, with the main character putting on masks, second, and I think more importantly, your teammates and your character each have their 1 core Persona – this represents the hero that everyone is in their core, which can however be hidden under the shadows that live in our mind (aka the Shadow). Hell, the Personas even have a form of literature heroes. Tearing off the mask is therefore a symbol of overcoming our Shadow and throwing away who we’ve been pretending to be to unleash the hero we truly are deep down. And I can tell you, it really works. That brings me to another thing. I think that making us realize the hero that’s the core of our soul is the central lesson of all heroic stories. And the Persona series is based on delivering this lesson in the utmost literal way. Since you’ve talked about classical heroes, you could talk about this as well.

It’s worth noting that, as the scientific fields of psychiatry & neurology have moved on to better justified, more evidence-based understandings, Jung’s theories have, along with Freuds, been basically entirely left behind. Not that the ideas aren’t still interesting and worthwhile when it comes to storytelling, but in terms of ‘how a for-real human being’s actual brain literally operates in our shared mathematical meatspace,’ Jung ranks pretty low. Basically, Jung, Freud, Myers-Briggs, these things all belong in the same box as tarot (no mistake that both jung and tarot have always featured heavily in persona games) or astrology – neat stories we make up that, to the extent that they tell us anything at all, are mostly just telling us what kinds of stories we like to hear about ourselves. They do not go in the box with astronomy, the box of ‘experimentally supported scientific fields of study offering current-best explanations of independently observable properties of the material universe.’

5:40 This is actually a key technique in building an instant rapport with someone, if you wish to get closer to them. Matching someones general personality, from your tone of voice to your facial expressions, and even to your posture, will cause them to be naturally drawn to you. The mind will see it as familiar, therefore safe.

The more interesting offshoot to me of the Jungian psychology business in Persona 5 is the narcissism inherent in the mechanic (present in all of the Persona games since 3) that only the main character can change his arcana and actually adopt a new persona. That is explicitly the power of the Fool arcana in Persona 3. Everyone else is stuck with their broad personality archetype, archetypes which largely remain consistent across games (not actually fitting the Jungian ones, but hey). The magician is always driven by passion, often immature sexual showboating, but quick to trust the main character and have strong feelings almost immediately (usually towards someone who dies). It is only “me” (the MC, who is always treated as a stand-in for the player) who has control and can modulate his personality. I wear different masks in society to interact with different people in a very Jungian way, but those I interact with have only their one mask and it (appears) to simply be who they truly are. Does that mean they’re lost in the mask, or that it is an unreliable narrator who is unable to recognize that as much as he changes his behavior to accommodate others, they’re doing the same with him? Or is it just because it would be difficult to implement anything more dynamic than “adopt this persona and play off of this archetype”, not to mention obscure the function from the player?

It’s possible that I’m misreading or abusing Jungian psychology when I say this, but to me, tearing off the mask to release the power of the Persona is very appropriate. Jungian psychology places an emphasis on acknowledging, facing, and assimilating one’s Shadow instead of rejecting it, in order to become a complete person. Players of Persona 4 will see the connection THAT game immediately. So I always saw the removal of the mask as being another way that the series is expressing that concept. It’s toying around with terminology, or perhaps making its own creative extension of Jungian thought, when it calls the figures “Personas” since they’re really much closer to the idea of the Shadow post-assimilation. Ripping off the mask is symbolic of rejecting the idea that one’s outer mask is one’s true self, and therefore also symbolic of assimilation of the Shadow (as Morgana even confirms when he says at one point that the characters’ Personas ARE their Shadows, just in a different form.) I wonder if I’m just letting Persona get away with this wishy-washy interpretation of Jungian ideas and terminology because I love it so much? The Persona is the constructed outward appearance, so you could argue that it’s actually the opposite of the Shadow, which is the stuff you want to hide from even yourself. But Jung talks all about how a force will tend to produce, strengthen, or even become its opposite (enantiodromia), so I guess Jungian psychology gives me an answer for that one too!

2:03 “Persona 5 pretty much nails this one.” …How? I feel like there should be more detail in this section. Waiting to give that detail until later, assuming that’s what you did and didn’t just end the thought there (haven’t finished the whole vid) is really jarring, honestly. You can’t assume everyone perusal the article has played the game your article is about, y’know? I feel like I’ve had the same issue with Extra Credits articles in the past, so it’s something I hope you guys will watch out for a little more carefully. This could be an isolated issue or something not everyone agrees with but I think it’s at least worth mentioning.

Why did he only list “loki” as the trickster. Coyote in Navajo stories is also a trickster. (Well, not just Navajo but I don’t feel comfortable talking about all native American stories as a monolithic mythology). Give some more examples of tricksters if you say they are all over the place. P.S. great article. Love you guys.

The issue with Persona 5 and doubting yourself that was mentioned at the end of the article is that the game not only takes every opportunity to ensure that you are doing good by messing with people’s head, having other characters talk for you if you don’t answer said question yourself, not having you as a person suffer any consequences as a result of your actions, as well as the plot ultimately taking a turn into the conspiratorial, thus making your actions necessary for the good of humanity, but also forces you into situations where you are FORCED to steal people’s hearts. The game wants you to steal people’s hearts and does everything in its power to make sure you want to, while avoiding and demonizing anyone and everyone who disagrees with you. The only sort of power trip that occurs with any meaningful progress is in a Confidant link, one that is completely optional and missable, thus removing it from any stance of relevance it might have had if a member of the main cast had it during the plot.

Something I would love in P6 is if we have a quick cameo of where the p5 people are. For example, some news talking about the Olympic games and mentioning Ryuji in athletism and Sumire in gymnastics, saying they’ve won a medal or whatever. It would be really nice, and I know they did similar stuff in p5 with the other characters, so it would definitely be possible.

I already commented on the original articles so there might not be as big of a comment here, but Kasumi and Maruki’s are new so I’ll check those out. When you think about it, Futaba essentially homeschooled herself during her hikikomori days. It’s impressive. What’s cool about Futaba’s arc is it flips the P4 stereotypes, Shadow Futaba represents the UPRIGHT Hermit while her real-world self represents the Reverse Hermit until her development. I didn’t realize that thing about Maruki in Rank 3 of Faith, interesting. But I definitely noticed the over-reliance on Joker. It’s actually part of why I’m not a fan of the ship, although it’s fine if people are. Something interesting I noticed when looking at Faith’s Personas: there’s a running theme of fantasy and fairy tales. Phoenix, Unicorn and Orichalcum are common creatures or concepts in fantasy while Okninushi, Siegfried, Tam Lin and Cu Chulainn are heroic warriors. And of course her Persona itself. This could represent the idealized lie she’s living. Only the ultimate Persona, Maria, relates to the Arcana’s origin as a deck commissioned by Italian Catholics. (The Maria design also comes from SMT Nine, which has some plot parallels to Maruki’s reality Regarding Maruki, have you seen the version of his farewell speech if you DON’T max his Confidant? It’s really interesting, as it’s arguably healthier than the maxed version, the one that leads to the new semester. In my opinion, this makes Maruki’s Confidant a unique deconstruction of the Social Link system, in that Joker’s influences ends up unwittingly encouraging the worse aspects of him.

Honestly, Sumire’s whole identity crisis arc is why I find it somewhat immoral to date her at the end of her confidant. She obviously has some deep emotional trauma, and she tends to cling onto those closest to her for support in lieu of growing on her own and carving an identity for herself. She did it with Kasumi before her death, she did it with Maruki after, and begins to do the same with Joker throughout the latter half of the game. I feel as if accepting her advances is somewhat analogous to allowing her to continue this cycle of co-dependency and guilt that has followed her through her entire life thus far. Shutting down those advances and allowing Sumire to grow on her own as a distant helping hand just seemed like the better option to me.

My mom loves tarot cards and reading. She told me the Magician is about transformation. Later I expressed my disappointment to her about how similar the Councillor was to the Magician. But she made me see a difference between how Morgana and Maruki represent the cards. Morgana is about Internal transformation. Maruki is about External transformation. Really shows how much thought is put into these characters.

To be honest I would love to see a Persona game like Tales of Beseria (a game where you are arguably the vengeful villain for most of the plot), like a redemptionless Count of Monte Cristo, of the Oceans movies (where the thieves win and have a happy ending) where the role of protagonist doesn’t mean righteous I think it would be incredibly interesting to be playing as the anti hero even straight up villain getting back at society for their revenge and benefit, they may change it and themselves for the better but it was for their own selfish drives. Basically imagine combining Joker and Akechi, you have a villainous protagonist gaming the unfair system with their power but also an underdog story about a Found Family if outcasts coming together and growing as people but simultaneously bringing out some of their most destructive aspects (I imagine this is how the mafia and Yakuza started). The fool is a driving force for change but like for Maruki that doesn’t mean it necessarily in a good direction, many of these characters could have been swayed the same way

This is a great analysis article of the characters! It definitely got me pumped up to pick up the game again tomorrow for PC and later for Switch. Your piece on Maruki is great and definitely hits in the feels now. Its so nice to see people honoring Billy still. Thanks for doing this and I can’t wait for part 2!

I’m so glad I stumbled onto your website! I finished P5 only about a year ago, even though I was intrigued about the franchise for a long time. I was so in awe with the sociological and philosophical context of this game, and wanted to learn more, but couldn’t find any interesting essays about P5 on Youtube. Until your website was recommended by the algorithm a couple of days ago! So here I am, happily binging your articles. Could you make one about the final boss of P5? Not Shido of course, but that godly creature that takes over Tokyo. I was blown away by the underlying philosophy of the evil that resides in relinquishing any responsibility.

I’m a newer fan of your articles. I just got to shidos palace and perusal your articles along the way has absolutely enhanced my game. I truly wish you would publish the audio only from these articles on Spotify. Listening at work would be great and I would be a listener! I love your perspective and I think it would be great to hear your take on other Japanese media (anime games anything really)