The sugar industry paid scientists in the 1960s to downplay the link between sugar and heart disease and emphasize the dangers of dietary fat. The Danvers data supported the case against saturated fats, providing the basis for a new formula relating fat intake to serum. Documents show that in the 1960s, the sugar industry funded Harvard researchers who dismissed concerns about sugar and doubled the risk factors of heart disease. The concept that saturated fat causes cardiovascular disease by raising serum cholesterol is called the “diet-heart hypothesis”.
A newly compiled list of foods and drinks commonly consumed in the United States hints at why many adults unknowingly overdo it on saturated fat and reveals that there is no evidence that saturated fat causes heart disease. The U.S. government was the first in the world to recommend saturated-fat restriction, and the “antisaturated fat” agenda became the agenda of the “antisaturated fat” movement.
The sugar industry paid scientists in the 1960s to play down the link between sugar and heart disease and promote saturated fat as the culprit instead. The long read highlights that in 1972, a British scientist sounded the alarm that sugar, not fat, was the greatest danger to our health. In the 1960s, the sugar industry funded research that downplayed the risks of sugar and highlighted the hazards of fat. The science now tells us that we need to consider saturated fats as a group of fatty acids rather than just sugar.
📹 Saturated Fat Conspiracy: Are Both Sides Wrong?
From the author of Kick Your Fat in the Nuts. Kickitinthenuts.com Home of the 12-week online weight loss course.
Should you never eat saturated fat?
The American Heart Association (AHA) recommends a dietary pattern that reduces saturated fat intake to less than 6 percent of total calories. This equates to no more than 120 calories from saturated fat per day, or 13 grams or less.
Is it true that you shouldn t eat a lot of saturated fat?
The ingestion of excessive quantities of saturated fats has been linked to an increased risk of cardiovascular disease, including heart disease and stroke. This is due to the elevation of “bad” LDL cholesterol in the blood. Conversely, high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol plays a role in removing excess cholesterol from the body, with the resulting waste products being disposed of in the liver.
In the United Kingdom, the majority of the population exceeds the recommended intake of saturated fat. The average intake for men and women is 30 grams and 20 grams, respectively, while children consume less than the recommended amount.
Can some saturated fat be good?
Research suggests that different types of saturated fats can have different effects on heart and circulatory disease risk. Stearic acid, found in meat and chocolate, doesn’t affect cholesterol levels. However, all foods contain a range of saturated fatty acids. Processed meat and processed meat are high in visible fats known to increase cholesterol levels. Processed meat is also high in salt, which can raise blood pressure, a risk factor for heart attack and stroke.
Most chocolate in the UK is high in added sugar and fat, leading to weight gain and increased risk of health conditions. There isn’t enough evidence to choose one saturated fat over another, so it’s better to swap them for oily fish, vegetable oils, or nuts.
Are eggs high in saturated fat?
Research has shown that most cholesterol in the body is made by the liver, not from dietary cholesterol. The liver is stimulated to make cholesterol primarily by saturated fat and trans fat in our diet, not dietary cholesterol. A large egg contains little saturated fat, about 1. 5 grams, and many healthy nutrients, including lutein and zeaxanthin, choline, and various vitamins (A, B, and D). One large egg contains 270 international units of vitamin A and 41 IU of vitamin D, about 6 g of protein, and 72 calories.
The evidence that cholesterol in one egg a day is safe for most people comes from large studies conducted at Harvard Medical School, which have followed hundreds of thousands of people over decades. They found no higher rates of heart attacks, strokes, or other cardiovascular diseases in people who ate up to one egg per day. However, it is important to note that the saturated fat in butter, cheese, bacon, sausage, muffins, or scones raises blood cholesterol more than the cholesterol in the egg.
Is saturated fat bad if you exercise?
Aerobic training can improve metabolic and cardiovascular health, prevent increased blood cholesterol after a high saturated fatty acid diet, and improve lipid and lipoprotein profiles, cardiovascular fitness, body composition, and diet in young women. This was found in a clinical trial conducted by Juan Fernando Ortega et al., which also examined the effects of resistance, aerobic, and combination training on young women’s health.
Is eating 6 eggs a day bad?
A daily intake of six eggs is considered to be excessive due to their high cholesterol content, with the recommended daily limit being 300 mg. However, individuals with diabetes or heart disease risk factors should limit their cholesterol intake to 200 mg, while others may consume one egg per day.
Is saturated fat bad Harvard?
The American Heart Association recommends limiting saturated fat in your diet to 5-6 percent of your daily calories, while the Dietary Guidelines for Americans suggest 10 is acceptable. Registered dietitian Kathy McManus suggests a healthy medium of 7, which is the typical amount of saturated fat in a heart-friendly Mediterranean-style diet. A sample menu in the May 2023 Heart Letter contains about 1, 900 calories, just below the 2, 000 daily calories recommended for the average woman.
About 12 of the calories in Dr. Ludwig’s sample menu are from saturated fat, which isn’t too much higher than the Dietary Guidelines limit of 10. A 1. 3-ounce piece of dark chocolate contains about eight grams of saturated fat, which is close to one-third of the 25 total grams of saturated fat in the sample menu.
McManus and other nutrition experts recommend focusing on eating mostly whole or minimally processed foods, which is also one of Dr. Ludwig’s main messages. His menu doesn’t include refined carbohydrates like white rice, white bread, sugary drinks, or other sweets. Muffins, cookies, pie, and other baked goods often contain a bit of saturated fat due to their use of butter, lard, vegetable shortening, or tropical oils like palm or palm kernel oil.
Is 5g saturated fat bad?
The UK’s population consumes a significant amount of saturated fat, with men and women consuming less than 30g and 20g respectively, and less than 5g of trans fat, respectively. Children should have less trans fat and saturated fat per day than adults. Nutrition labels on food packaging indicate the total fat and saturated fat content, helping individuals maintain their recommended daily intake. While saturated fats are typically consumed more than trans fats, it is important to check food labels for trans fats, which are typically listed as ‘hydrogenated fats’ or ‘hydrogenated vegetable oils’.
How much saturated fat per 100g is okay?
To choose healthy foods, opt for foods with more unsaturated fats and those labeled green or amber for saturated fat. Some high-fat foods, like oily fish, nuts, oils, and spreads, may be red for saturated fat, but these contain a higher proportion of healthy unsaturated fats. Low-fat foods have 3g or less and low saturated fat is 1. 5g or less per 100g of food. High fat foods have 17. 5g or more and high saturated fat is 5g or more per 100g of food. Labels on food packaging can help check the amount and type of fat. Use the table as a guide for choosing healthy foods.
What is the truth about saturated fat?
A diet high in saturated fats can increase total cholesterol and lead to more harmful LDL cholesterol, causing blockages in arteries. Nutrition experts recommend limiting saturated fat to under 10 calories a day. Recent studies have muddied the link between saturated fat and heart disease, with one meta-analysis suggesting there is not enough evidence to conclude that saturated fat increases the risk of heart disease.
Two other major studies suggest that replacing saturated fat with polyunsaturated fats like vegetable oils or high-fiber carbohydrates is the best way to reduce heart disease risk, while replacing saturated fat with highly processed carbohydrates could do the opposite.
Is 20 grams of saturated fat a day a lot?
The recommended daily intake of saturated fat is 30 grams for males and 20 grams for females. Furthermore, it is recommended that overall fat intake be reduced and that saturated fat be replaced with unsaturated fats, including omega-3 fats.
📹 Joe Rogan – Does Saturated Fat Cause Heart Disease?
Taken from Joe Rogan Experience #1175: https://www.youtube.com/embed/ULtqCBimr6U.
Well when in comes to diet and cholesterol to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also for looking in to this matter from a different perspective and without being condemning from one’s views and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering everyone’s valid opinion, i honestly believe i forgot what i was going to say
I have high cholesterol and eat lots of saturated fat yet I have had multiple coronary artery calcium scans over the last few years that have scored zero which means I have zero buildup/blockage in my coronary arteries, so no heart disease. As the first guy pointed out we didn’t see lot of heart attacks in the early 20th century but we did start seeing them increase exponentially in the later 20th century. Why? It wasn’t because more people were eating more saturated fat. It was the opposite. More people were eating less saturated fat and more processed sugar laden foods. It’s not the cholesterol and saturated fat that causes heart disease it’s the sugar and junk carbs.
Key thing here is the fact that this seemed to boom after WWII. That’s when processed convenience foods became widely distributed. And fast food chains followed. The fact that this wasn’t our great great great grandparents case who ate meat dairy, eggs, vegetation, lived off the land, tells you most likely it’s the processed crap that is the problem. Eat more whole food, plants and meats.
I have genetic high cholesterol, born with it and in my family. My grandfather had his first heart transplant when he was only 45. When I was 18 I had arteries that were “clogged” in the 99 percentile to the point that they were those of a 40 year. After taking medication and reducing cholesterol and saturated fat in my diet (I am vegetarian now, say what you want about that) my arteries have cleaning out to the 50 percentile and that of a mid 20 year old. This was only 4 years.
Up until the industrial revolution and before we could ship fruits around the globe, the majority of the world was in ketosis for 9-10 months of the year. Cholesterol is not a factor unless there is a pre-existing nutrient deficiency, typically Vitamin C. This deficiency in our American society is typically caused by excessive blood insulin, which in turn is related to excessive carbohydrate ingestion. Dietary cholesterol (that which comes from the foods you eat) only accounts for 20-25% of the cholesterol your liver makes each and every day. These knuckle heads are arguing over something which is not significant. Well…one is arguing. The body needs lots of cholesterol. Your nerve myelin sheaths, brain cells, sex organs, hormones, thyroid T4-T3 conversion and a bunch of other processes require cholesterol production. Seeing cholesterol build up in blood vessels is a sign that something else is going wrong in the vascular and arterial walls (lesions). have you noticed that cholesterol is only a topic at issue with regard to heart and vascular health? Why is that? Do you think the human body uses cholesterol and saturated fats well for all other systems and then somehow f***s up with regard to this singular system?? Think about it, the rise in heart attacks coincides with the rise in dietary sugars. We didn’t have the availability of year round processed grains and processed sugars and fruits until the last 120 years or thereabouts. Lipoproteins carry BOTH cholesterol and triglycerides.
What the guy in black doesn’t acknowledge is that excessive carbohydrates oxidize LDL and help create Lipoprotein(a), preventing the recycling of LDL by the liver. Lipoprotein(a) is readily absorbed into the blood vessel lining, where macrophages soak up the molecules, creating the white foam that puts pressure on the cell wall and leads to calcification of the arteries.
What they aren’t including in this discussion that I personally believe weighs very heavy on the amount of heart attacks and cholesterol, etc, etc, etc. is SMOKING AND STRESS. The speaker just glossed over the smoking contribution. Heavy saturated fat eaters coupled with smoking and stress. Men were dropping dead from smoking and stress. Okay so he admits smoking might effect it.
I was gaining weight and feeling really bad no matter what I was doing…exercising, lower calories. When you realize your body has no idea what a calorie is and that is a finely tuned machine that is controlled by hormones, losing weight and getting healthy is pretty easy….food isnt entertainment…it is nutrition.
i like how he saids look at japan less cholesterol than americans look at france they eat all the stuff our guidelines say not to eat and they have very low risk at having heart attacks and have low cholesterol compared to us. what people over look is the lifestyles japan and france both have very active cultures it’s not uncommon for someone in france to walk on an advantage 5 miles a day. i know some people here that sit in a office and do next to no walking maybe walk 5 miles a week. it’s not just what you eat it’s also how you live. japan also eats differently most don’t keep enough food in their homes to last 3 days. they eat less and eat out while on the move and don’t eat late. how many people in america work late and eat when they get home. there’s a million factors. constant hard stress on a person who eats right and works out can cause a rise in cholesterol. our system is so fed up it’s crazy for years they told us crap like margarine and diet sodas was great for us. Now they say their horrible for you.
Fact Check at 5:32. The claim that two tablespoons of olive oil contains more saturated fat than a 7oz pork chop – Not true. Two tablespoons of olive oil contains 3.8g of saturated fat and a 7oz (198g) pork chop contains 8.5g of saturated fat. Pork chop (even a small 7oz one), has double the saturated fat of two tablespoons of olive oil. This is “a little-known fact” because it’s total BS. – Besides, who eats Two tablespoons of olive oil in the first place – a bad comparison.
How about they try using the word OVERCONSUMPTION? This word is downplayed to the point where “authorities” within a subject use it as a invisible catalyst to carry an idea. However it’s importance could be the central thesis of the arguement. There are other countries that have access and consume the same types of high fatty or processed foods that we have. But why are their obesity levels, heart disease levels, and heart attack risks so low in comparison to ours? Because America consumes up to 5x the amount of something that the rest of the world does, Britain is EVEN MORE! They brought up Japan alot, arguably the healthiest country in the world, but failed to mention their portion sizes and consumption rates compared to ours. We over consume almost everything that doesnt have a warning label and even then still fuck it up with the massive pharmaceutical OD death statistics rising and alot of them are accidental. So you put NO WARNING on overconsumption for alcohol, fast food, or processed food, and then consume 5x the amount required for energy and nutrition, then act surprised when your cells call it quits after being redlined everyday for 15 years? Try putting a 63 Octane rated fuel in your car and then drive everyday carrying maximum load, and scratch your head when the engine says FUCK YOU and seizes.
This is very important and easy to miss!!! Kresser brings up two meta-analyses at 7:05, which Kahn fails to strongly rebut UNTIL 19:55. It’s obvious that Kahn had responses but didn’t immediately realize which studies Kresser was referring to (since he doesn’t reference authors). Also, Kresser never responds to Kahn’s points, indicating that he may have missed the fact that he was addressing the two meta-analyses he brought up as evidence! If you don’t connect those dots, you’d be left thinking Kresser’s 1-2 punch was KO, but those studies were widely criticized as Kahn touches on.
I would be really curious to see a study comparing low carb diets to moderate/high carb diets BUT with one group consuming mostly processed and simple carbs (packaged and boxed snacks, high sugar cereals etc) and the other group consuming complex and natural carbs. Or at least have more studies when comparing low carb diets to diets who are eating carbs but only complex ones (i.e. sweet potatoes, quinoa, sprouted no sugar added breads etc.) because I wonder if when they are using individuals who eat carbs that are filthy carbohydrates and loaded with weird oils, sugars and stuff like de-caking agents and other weird chemicals that we shouldn’t be eating to make the product look, feel, or smell a certain way that naturally wouldn’t be so. I think there would be a huge difference in results.
From Garth Davis, MD: Let’s start with the statement that there is no evidence that dietary cholesterol affects cholesterol. Wrong! It is true that most of our cholesterol is synthesized, only about 20-30% comes from diet. Also true that there is down regulation in synthesis with increased consumption. So we absorb about 60% of consumed cholesterol BUT this number may be lower if you are a high consumer and higher if you are a low consumer, which is why vegans will see a dramatic rise in cholesterol if they start eating it. That being said, ward studies show a very definitive increase in cholesterol with eating cholesterol. The prospective ward studies show an increase of 2-2.5 mg/dL per 100 mg of cholesterol. So he is clearly wrong. This effect is much lower than saturated fats effect on cholesterol. In fact, studies Kresser will cite to show dietary cholesterol won’t increase serum cholesterol were studies that increased dietary cholesterol BUT decreased saturated fat. A sneaky way to publish a study saying dietary cholesterol doesn’t increase serum cholesterol. Now the statement that higher cholesterol doesn’t affect mortality is UTTERLY wrong. I mean, c’mon!!! You could write a book on this, and many have been written. Hundreds of studies. This is why we have cholesterol lowering drugs. I can list so many studies here but let’s go with this recent excellent prospective study on people with low risk followed 10 yrs. ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.118.
I went vegan after two successive yearly blood tests showing upward trending cholesterol and blood sugar. After one year vegan on a whole foods plant based diet, all markers dropped back into healthy range. Lost 12 kilos and my cardio fitness and general energy levels have increased dramatically. Before this change of diet I was consuming a predominantly Mediterranean diet and thought vegans were loopy. Having made the change the only regret I have now is not doing it earlier.
Animal products are higher in LDL fat which is the bad cholesterol. The problem is that crooked doctors fight against the notion that saturated fat does correlate to cholesterol by taking a sample of people who already consume ridiculous amounts of saturated fat so if you increase it, they show little to no change. BUT if you control for base levels of cholesterol it does indicate a correlation between consumption of saturated fat and cholesterol.
By the time this episode was over I was actually getting angry, and asking what in the world is their point ? So, its not conclusive that saturated fat causes heart disease according to studies Chris saw… The episode after this one was great and way more informative and interesting. Both of the guys on this episode here both started sounding idiotic by an hour in. rehashed themselves over and over and over for hours.
Joe seems very partial in this debate, he fails as a debate host because he not objective……The last question asking about 50 year old study, when he just spend the last 5 minutes talking about a study from 2008…..Like Joe but in this instance the act idiotic, he clearly didnt listen to the guy, just waited to attack his argument, without listening to his argument. Stay objective or you just pollute the water, let the experts debate.
Cholesterol repairs your artery walls from inflammation and everything modern people eat is inflammatory. To fix this one could either stop eating dietary cholesterol so there’s less of it to repair your artery wall or you could stop eating all the foods which cause inflammation. Since it is easier for the average person to cut out cholesterol from the diet and delay death, this is what the guidelines advice. The correct approach is to stop eating foods which cause inflammation which is virtually anything that is non organic, anything that is processed, anything that is man made. This eliminates 99% of what people eat leaving just organic meat and organic seasonal fruit.
The anti-saturated fats guy completely ignores two major early studies showing that substituting supposedly heart-healthy polyunsaturated fats for saturated fats provided no identifiable benefit in cardiovascular event reduction. Those were the Minnesota Coronary Experiment and the Sydney Heart Study. Both studies were large-scale, long-term, randomized control trials. Both came to the same conclusion that polyunsaturated fats, primarily vegetable oils, provided no benefit. Both occurred in the 1960s and 1970s. The researchers suppressed the results of both tests and hid them from public knowledge for about 50 years. They refused to publish the results of the tests because the results proved their saturated fat hypothesis to be wrong.
One thing I will say is that every time this argument comes up about dietary/animal/saturated fat causing heart attacks or not – all the proponents of that hypothesis state “every health agency says this and these people live this long with low fat diets” but then the detractors from the hypothesis point to dozens of cited studies and thousands of articles and excerpts from studies. Seems like one side has a stronger case than the other.
He never scooped sugar out of a blocked artery. Dumb statement. Eating sugar and other carbohydrates raises triglycerides and lowers HDL. It also causes dysfunctional alterations in LDL molecules. LDL levels may seem normal, but this dysfunctional LDL can cause rapid clogging of arteries and increased risk for thrombosis.
As Dr. Kahn said, the first major study to suggest high fat intake was related to heart disease was Ancel Keys “Seven Country Study”. What he failed to mention was that it was originally a 22 country study, but threw out the 2/3rds of the countries that didn’t fit his hypothesis, including France, which has some of the highest fat intake in the world but also the lowest cardiac death rate. Pate, foie gras? They don’t even use olive oil, they use butter. Read about this ridiculous study and it’s early and current criticisms here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_Countries_Study . Furthermore, big pharma spent over $100 M on research regarding lowering cholesterol and came up with nothing so they fudged the stats and used “Relative Risk” instead of “Absolute Risk” to amplify a 1% difference between placebo and cholesterol-lowering drugs to over 33%. I LOL with a commercial I saw last night for the triglyceride-lowering drug Vascepa. At 0:16 it literally states “It is not known if Vascepa reduces your risk of having an inflamed pancreas, a heart attack or a stroke.” ? LOL! Watch it here: youtube.com/watch?v=6Ujrm–bbVc . So WTF would you be taking it for? People, I’m a physician. Go low carb, learn how to keep your pelvis in a neutral position to avoid spine problems, exercise at least 2-3 a week, sleep 7-8 hours a night, and keep good relations with your family and you will live into your 100s with little need to see me or my colleagues.
I became interested in dietary chemistry 2 decades ago. Was a lab tech for many years, have my degree in chemistry and biology. Inflammation, lack of sun, too much sugar and processed fats, and vitamin C deficiency is whats causing heart disease. Here’s the process. Vitamin C follows a similar pathway as glucose. Sugar and Vitamin C intake simultaneously ends with most of that C being excreted in urine, unused. Coronary arteries are under a lot of pressure and movement. The Artery wall gets damaged because it takes Vitamin C to maintain these walls, fibrin and cholesterol patch the damage just like a scab. Because the damage never gets fixed(low Vitamin C) this patch work builds up over time. Sun. cholesterol is converted to vitamin D when the sun hits your skin. Cholesterol is also a good marker of inflammation. Since its a repair material, high cholesterol means your body has a lot of damaged cells. Processed oils. Canola is supposed to be heart healthy but its not. Because its highly processed(inedible otherwise) the oils come from the factory mostly rancid and easily oxidized. These oils become really sticky when oxidized. Look at how hard it s to clean splash guards around fryers and you’ll understand what I mean. Saturated fats are more stable and not easily oxidized. Sugars. There’s another makeup of the plaque found in arterial walls. Triglycerides. They test triglycerides as well when testing cholesterol and is also a good indicator of heart disease chance. Triglycerides are the result of excess glucose being turned into fat.
American diet does not represent high meat diet but high omega-6 diet. I think cholesterol plaque is caused by oxidated LDL which does not fit in the receptors and stays trapped in the blood stream. Not by high cholesterol, damaged cholesterol! Sugar and omega-6 seems to damage it most. Problem with diet studies is theyre almost impossible to control. Youd have to lock people in cages and feed them to be accurate. You can be eating steaks and eggs cooked in butter, no oxidation/inflamation or eat proccesed burgers full of preservatives and emulsifiers. Fries boiled in vegetable oils full of omega-6 and for those studies both of those are meat eaters. We need a long term study of true carnivores, only animal fat dieters and then we can take results more serious.
I’m a fitness trainer of 25 years. One word: Adkins. High saturated fat diet, high cholesterol diet, low REFINED CARBOHYDRATES, low REFINED SUGARS = lower bad cholesterol, higher good cholesterol. Saturated fats and high cholesterol are only bad when you mix with refined carbs and sugars. No more than 20 grams of saturated fat per day (Even good Sat Fats), eat unrefined carbs and sugars for your energy level of the day, push your heart with cardiovascular aerobic exercise 5-6 days per week. Push your muscles with weight resistance of some kind 3-5 days per week. Period.
Plant based is difficult to sustain long term for most. In the short term, you see how your skin radiates with health. Something is right about that. Overall, you can have a small portion of meat and dairy but the majority of your intake should be whole plant foods. I think that is a reasonable stance on food consumption.
Guy in black is so dense it hurts. “I have been inside hearts 15000 times and I never scoop sugar out of arteries, it’s cholesterol” This statement that he made essentially boils down why he’s so wrong. He makes the false assumption that the presence of cholesterol in plaque is caused by cholesterol and not by damage to endothelial tissue to which ldl cholesterol binds to in order to repair. It’s such an outdated idea that cholesterol is bad and it basically means that doctors are accusing the firefighters of the arsonists crime. The main mechanism in actuality that typically causes heart disease is sugar. Sugar has an effect that glycates the body’s cells and causes damage. Seed oils and other free radicals also are major causes of oxidation that in turn causes the plaqueing that makes heart disease. Another thing I found interesting is the guy in black discussing lobbying from big dairy. This is entirely true that a lot of diary is not beneficial for humans. But what he fails to mention is that Big Pharma and Big food manufacturers completely influence the American heart association, the American Diabetes Association, as well as funding thousands of bogus studies with misleading titles and abstracts (most physicians do not read beyond the abstract of a study.) I feel I’m wasting my time procrastinating my homework right now so I’ll just throw a couple interesting pieces of data out there for y’all: 75% of the funding that the FDA uses to approve/deny pharmaceutical drugs comes from Big pharma “donations.
It is crucial for overall health, especially for men, to have fat and cholesterol in your body. The body makes for example testosterone out of it. The lack of L-arginine is the real cause of heart decease, according to recent scientific studies. L-arginine “converts to nitrogen and makes the small blood vessels contract in the heart.. Amongst many other things.
It’s comical how willing people are to throw aside the opinion of a person that’s dedicated 40 plus years to studying the heart and is a practicing cardiologist. His mantra is simple, plant based diets, whole food, high quality. He’s not promising miracles, and he always acknowledges holes in studies. Dr. Kahn’s point about the dairy industry meeting and the following meta analysis was glossed over, and that’s worth raising an eyebrow at the very least. I’ll take my chances at being as plant based as I possibly can, I still partake in high saturated fat foods periodically, but I know I feel better when getting complex carbs and plant based protiens and more veggies….period. I also know the quadruple bypass I had after years of a crappy high saturated fat diet, and tinkering with the keto diet, is motivation enough for me to not trust someone that says fat and crap in my diet doesn’t matter. It does. It’s not the only factor, but it matters.
What Joel missed to point out is that although an increase in saturated fat does spike ones cholesterol, it is only temporary. Ones cholesterol will go back to normal levels after having a consistent diet whether or not high in saturated fats. I’m not saying you should binge on saturated fat though, moderation is key. Most dietary problems evolve from over consumption and the best thing to do is have a balanced diet.
Don’t forget the Maasai in Africa, they live on meat, blood and milk, yet heart attacks are unheard of. The same applies to the Inuit who live on seal fat. It is sugar and high insulin (insulin resistance) that is the real culprit. Many people are pre diabetic yet don’t know it. Just look at the amount of carbs (sugar) the average American eats.
People, just take the best of both worlds: eat a balanced diet, try limiting animal products where possible, really limit processed carbs, entirely avoid processed sugar + food. More importantly, exercise, keep mentally healthy by having plenty of time doing things you love, some of which need to be dedicated to social bonding. And you’re set. Now, go on live life.
My own study found that when I became metabolically healthy, my cholesterol improved in every category (expanded panel every 6 months) I focus on high protein high fat but not avoiding carbs or sweets completely, definitely not avoiding alcohol. But avoiding being a sedentary fat ass like it was the 1 risk factor
The entire premise that saturated fats and cholesterol cause CAD is ridiculous. We humans have thrived on animal protein and fat for millions of years. Cholesterol is what the sex hormones, cortisol and vitamin D are made from. Our brains and every cell contain cholesterol. We make it, how is it now bad? We got into huge trouble when the low fat high carb crap became the rule. I’m in my 60s and lived through the transition and the rates of obesity and diabetes exploded with the push for grain based high carb food. You’d have to be an idiot to not see the connection. I eat a high animal fat, almost no carb diet. My labs and blood pressure are perfectly normal. Heart disease does not run in my family. Genetics is a greater factor in who will develop CAD.
Yeah, I’m surprised there’s even a debate on this. Just scrolling through the comments and you’ll see multiple people saying their arteries were clogging up, then they went vegan/vegetarian and their arteries cleared. The answer is pretty obvious 🤣 Also you’ll never hear of someone clogging up their arteries because they ate too many vegetables.
Awesome talk! It was quite clear who was the guy actually thinking and bringing up concrete examples and facts instead of just “but mah 50 year old consensus!”. The guy even said he never found sugar in the blocked arteries but found cholesterol. Who could trust this guy’s judgment after such an insane comment? He keeps such a high level discussion of the topics and just mentions that some comparison between “wildly different diets” showed correlation between one of the diets and disease. So what is the reason? Did they control for every difference? The smart guy brings up concrete examples with the relevant and interesting details and they apparently showed no causation (or even correlation) between saturated fats and heart disease. Thanks a lot for this discussion!
The average cholesterol in The Blue Zones is 260. Recent studies show that once one is in the age of 50s they live longer if their cholesterol rises above 200. Think about this, cholesterol is the body’s repairer and restorer. It makes sense that as a person ages the need of reparative functions increases. When cholesterol production is limited we see rises in diseases such as Alzheimer’s and heart disease as well. What has to be put in view isn’t merely cholesterol levels, it is insulin levels. Even more dangerous is high dietary fat or protein in conjunction with excessive sugars/carbs. Why? Because these combinations produce higher blood insulin levels than merely carbohydrates alone. What this suggests is that increases in dietary fats should occur in tandem with lowering dietary carbohydrates. When this is done you allow systems to repair. Once you begin to see that excessive carbohydrate metabolism is what rots and damages the systems you will begin to see how necessary and helpful fats are. Keep in mind that your body makes far more cholesterol than you can invest through your diet. Your dietary fats only account for about 1/5th of your daily cholesterol. Also, the more fats you ingest the less your liver produces. In other words, your body works to maintain the same levels of cholesterol production totals regardless of how much you eat. This is part of the homeostasis which your liver strives for. This renders the subject of dietary intake to be less important than the gentleman on the left suggests.
What about ethnic heritage? My 23&Me and Ancestry DNA results show I’m 70% Irish and the pre-Colombian Irish ate dairy and seafood. So I’ve kept my already high diary intake the same and I’ve been eating more shrimp and salmon and I feel a like I have more energy at the gym. Maybe it’s placebo, or maybe it’s the higher Omega-3s but I would like to see if there it’s advantageous to stick to your ancestor’s diet.
Its strange that experts attempt to talk about a multivariate problem like coronary heart disease (CHD) focusing on only one of its variables. CHD is in its essence a chronic inflammatory disease of the heart arteries that has multiple factors affecting its initiation and its course.Mind you, coronary atherosclerosis can be either benign or malignant which is mainly determined by the stability of the coronary plaque. Plaques that are “stable” are very frequent, can span many decades growing slowly either never giving birth to a clinical event i.e. a heart attack or manifesting as angina (chest pain on exertion) a condition that constitutes no emergency and can usually in most cases be treated safely with medicine although some people will eventually require some kind of tactical procedure. Unstable plaques on the other hand,are more sparse but when they rupture become the culprits of heart attacks that are extremely dangerous and many times lethal. Its this second kind of plaques that have been more and more frequent for the last 100 years. So the question if we want to be clinically precise is really not “what’s causing coronary heart disease” but “what makes coronary plaques unstable”. Again having in mind that unstable plaque formation is mainly an inflammatory process which is affected mainly by smoking, genetics, environmental factors, diet, blood pressure, stress,obesity and sedentary lifestyle, one can clearly see that trying to measure the impact of only one of the factors (i.
The problem with the studies the guy on the left is referring to is that they’re not 10% or less carbohydrates. There isn’t one study showing a well formulated ketogenic diet (5 to 10% carbohydrates, 20% protein and 70 to 75% fat) or carnivore diet increases risk for CVD. If anything as Kessler says, those diets lower the markers for CVD. Remnant cholesterol is the most important measure of cholesterol in our blood. Even fasting blood sugar isn’t a reliable measure of insulin resistance if you’re active. A1c, triglycerides, C-reactive protein, and remnant cholesterol seem to be the new measuring sticks for healthy blood and overall health.
Cholesterol is produced in the liver everyday regardless of whether you eat eggs,meat cheese or chicken etc…. If it’s bad for us then why would the liver produce it every single day? Because it’s needed to produce sex hormones and repair tissue damage. High cholesterol means there is inflammation also known as tissue damage somewhere in the body. Besides smoking or excessive drinking, heart disease is mostly caused by too much daily stress and lack of quality sleep. To blame everything on Saturated fat is plain stupid.
All that you have to look at is what the longest living people on the planet eat(THE BLUE ZONES), is always low saturated fat, few animal products. So many studies are funded to sell the product, that will never stop. I don’t hear of any centenarian colonies that live mostly on meat and animal products, that’s good enough for me
Healthy natural fats are great for you, but how do you consume them? For instance, burned fats are oxidized and come with a hit to your health, also… many fats like Fish Oil and Seed Oils are damaged simply by light exposure, making them oxidized, etcetera, etcetera…. IMO the elephant in the room is EMF which these back and forth debates of confusion never seem to mention. Wallace published a lot on that topic.
Surely the entire diet, nothing in isolation, is essential for good health and less dis-ease! Mexico drinks the most Coca-Cola than anywhere else on the planet. Type 2 diabetes is killing people in high numbers 😢. Sugar and artificial sweetners, especially fructose Sugar. Cancer is at epidemic levels in the west?
This is from Health Havard: Only about 20% of the cholesterol in your bloodstream comes from the food you eat. Your body makes the rest. Cholesterol has a bad reputation, thanks to its well-known role in promoting heart disease. Excess cholesterol in the bloodstream is a key contributor to artery-clogging plaque, which can accumulate and set the stage for a heart attack. However, the role of cholesterol in your body is not all negative. To fully explain cholesterol, you need to realize that it’s also vital to your health and well-being. Although we measure cholesterol production in the blood, it’s found in every cell in the body. The Harvard Special Health Report Managing Your Cholesterol explains cholesterol as a waxy, whitish-yellow fat and a crucial building block in cell membranes. Cholesterol also is needed to make vitamin D, hormones (including testosterone and estrogen), and fat-dissolving bile acids. In fact, cholesterol production is so important that your liver and intestines make about 80% of the cholesterol you need to stay healthy. Only about 20% comes from the foods you eat. (See illustration.) If the general consensus is that Cholesterol is naturally occuring in the human body, surely the question should be how does Cholesterol get into the arteries? This debate will rage on but people who have lost weight and feel better on a Ketogenic lifestyle which promotes a high fat low carb diet will stick to it, I’m in this camp. I’ve seen my weight drop from 96kg to 84kg since I started keto with time restricted eating on the 12th of March this year.
Hey Chris. If you believe saturated fat and cholesterol don’t increase the chances of cardiovascular disease, then please eat them as 35% of your total calorie consumption for two years. Then have your blood numbers measured live on camera. They will be significantly elevated. Who bought you off? Meat or dairy? All of the studies you cite have been sponsored by the meat or dairy industry. It’s in their best interest to skew the science.
After perusal the article on youtube “Joe Rogan – Does Saturated Fat Cause Heart Disease?” I skeptical of the discussion surrounding the link that was said to exist between saturated fat consumption and heart disease. The article features two doctors, Dr. Kahn and Dr. Kresser, who go on to present some differing viewpoints on the topic. In this comment I will look at these viewpoints from an ethical standpoint from a medical viewpoint. Dr. Kahn advocates for a plant-based diet that is low in saturated fat, while we get Dr. Kresser arguing that saturated fat is not the villain but it is made out to be but instead it can be part of a healthy diet. Both doctors presented research studies to support their arguments, but it is seemingly difficult to discern which studies are actually valid and reliable. The American Heart Association (AHA) recommends limiting saturated fat intake to less than 6% of our daily caloric intake, citing numerous studies linking saturated fat consumption to an increased risk of heart disease. The AHA additionally recommends a diet high in fruits, vegetables, whole grains, lean protein, and low-fat dairy products. These recommendations are all based on the principle of non-maleficence, which means to do no harm, and the principle of beneficence, which focuses on promoting health and well-being. However, it’s important to note that the AHA has been criticized for its ties to the food industry and this could cause it to promote low-fat products that are often high in added sugars and refined carbohydrates, which is shown to be bad in other studies.
The process, called lipogenesis, creates lipids (fat) from the acetyl CoA and takes place in the cytoplasm of adipocytes (fat cells) and hepatocytes (liver cells). When you eat more glucose or carbohydrates than your body needs, your system uses acetyl CoA to turn the excess into fat. These lipids(fats) are very sticky. They are transported in the blood. These days are what clogs arteries and fills organs with fat. Liver, heart, etc.
Seriously a Chiropractor is pitted against a Cardiologist in a debate on heart diseases. And people with bad food habits cheering on a chiropractor because he is saying good things about their bad food habits. It should be someone like Neil Barnard or Dr. Esselstyn who are into research and could counter the misleading interpretation by this Chiropractor
So… what one could gather here… is that if one avoids refined sugars, processed foods, and reduces their saturated fat intake you’ll be a fucking superhero. if one doctor is saying remove saturated fat and another one saying remove refined carbohydrates / sugars from your diet because it’ll lower your LDL, what’s the harm of this removing both? Or at least restricting saturated fat intake. Fruits veggies meat. Got it.
The world needs THE HOMER SIMPSON METHOD when speaking about Diabetes and what to do! Keep it simple! So simple that even Homer Simpson can understand what you are saying! Most articles or booklets on Diabetes are full of jargon that confuses the person perusal or reading them. Carbs cause insulin spikes! Carbs are not good for you! Maybe a few blueberries now and then! Eat lots of fat and protein ONCE a day! Do intermittant fasting 16/8. Start at 10 pm Finish at 4 pm. Have a light meal to break your fast! Then have your main meal at 8 pm. I have some lambs liver for the light meal and lamb chops for the main course. I take my multivitamins near 10 pm. Also potassium and magnesium; a half tea spoon each. I take a tablespoon of coconut oil before bed. I never knew that I didn’t need to be eating all the time and much of it junk. Intermittent fasting allows the body to do what it was created for. Too many people assoiate fasting with religion & sin. Religion gave fasting a bad name! OK!
You will never convince me that people in Japan don’t eat high amounts of saturated fat. The Japanese eat high amounts of fish. A quick Google search shows that the Japanese eat about three ounces of fish per day. Fish contains saturated fat. So the statement of, The Japanese have almost zero fat in their diet, is horse shit.
i’m a doctor. but the argument FOR saturated fats belies logic. it’s actually not an argument for sat fats at all. it’s an argument that asks for proof that they are bad in much the same way of those that argue that there’s is no proof that violent article games cause violent/damaged children/adults. it’s disingenuous at best.
another glaring mistake about low and high carb trials. there is tremendous amounts of dollars involved in swaying people’s opinions to make purchases of one product over another. and most people simply do not know what they are talking about when they simply use the terms low-carb and high-carb. carbohydrates from natural foods are not the same as carbohydrates from manufactured foods. i once had some crazy guy on a low-carb forum talking about having to limit the amount of carrots he eats, cuz they have higher amounts of carbs than most other vegetables !!
The problem is not burning your blood sugars, glycogen stores and fat reserves during the break–fast time from last morsel at night till first morsel in morning and then eating, calling for insulin and re-stuffing already full cells, liver, fat and muscle. Results are progressive insulin resistance and increase in blood sugar which inflames endothelial cells leading to atherosclerosis. Solution, stretch break–fast to 16/8 intermittent, watch your blood sugar drop and weight come off and you get healthier. ie we eat to f-ing much. Peace
Lifestyle, stress, lack of sleep are big factors when it comes to health. Okinawans have a different life than Americans. I dont care how good you eat, if you don’t get adequate sleep, have a stressful life or job and don’t exercise it will affect your health. The studies back in the day need to be updated to todays lifestyle .
Saturated fat, bad cholestrol, acidic animal protein, oxidative heme iron, antibiotics, IGF1 growth hormones, mindless over consumption of meat, dairy, eggs, refined oils, sugar and salt, massive corporate agricultral food industries is bad for us. Eating a varied wholefood plantbased diet is good for us. Dont eat animals or highly processed refined foods. Eat a majority of whole plant foods, everyday. Dont be lazy. You will feel good, you will do good, for yourself, for the animals, for the planet. The end 🙂
First rude guy simply ignores everything he says is correlation, not causation. Secondly, there are 2 kinds of LDL, and when you are on a low carb diet, then you do not have the small dense particles that ARE associated with the cardiovascular issues. That’s why keto dieters with high LDL are perfectly healthy from a cardiovascular point of view.
I ate 50 to 70% fat and low sugar or no sugar and lots of fatty meats, fatty fish, fruit, berries and all vegetables and my cholesterol and triglycerides plummeted and I finally reached my goals. To me, or for me: a combo of Keto, Carnivore and Mediterranean diets worked best and my new primary care doctor agreed. I do need occasional sugars and complex carbs because I have hypoglycemia. Strict Keto is not for everyone Also, too much fat is not good either. Because it will spike your lypase enzyme from your pancreas and you’ll get pancreatitis. Stomach cramps and a trip to the ER room will teach you. Moderation is key. But fatty beef, chicken, duck, and chops is good. Bacon is great. Just don’t overeat and over do it with bacon. Animal fat does not put fat on the body. Sugars and refined carbs do. Watch all the juices too. Most juices, even OJ, is not much different than drinking sugary soda. Ice cream is deadly. Your combing a sugar molecule with a fat molecule. Easy way to gain weight and get huge. Also, pies, cakes, and cookies also make you huge. They all put fat in the body. Not animal fat. Imported cheese is good for you. In fact, imported anything is good and better for you. Imported bread or bread from France and Italy are totally different than any bread in the U.S. Europe has strict laws on food. U.S. wants to mess with you.
What changed in 1940s? Calories shot through tue roof coming out of the depression. Mr. Kellogg convinced goverment to subsidize grains because so many drafties were under wait. His motive had way more to do with reducing testrone. It worked too well in both accounts. Then in the 60 to combat weight we encouraged low fat which led to food manufacturers increasing sugar in food especially with how cheap high fructose corn syrup was and then they told everyone to stop eating saturated fat and instead theu ate trans fats. Both I. The 40s and 60s we seen huge spikes in heart disease and weight . Most of these observational diet don’t exclude anything. So have guys saying the eat real kean but it’s hamburger with fries and supervised drink and then they blame the issues on the burger. What do people eat butter on? Dry carb rich foods to give it flavor. Look at grass fed beef next to grain fed and the amount of fat in the meat this isn’t because the cow is eating more fat it’s because it’s eating more carbs
whenever a claim is made about diet, or medicine, i just ask myself ‘do i trust 70yrs of dietary science, over millions of years of human/primate evolution?’ invariably i dont, and i default to common sense. if you want to eat healthy, eat some meat, some fruit, some vegetables, some nuts, avoid sugar as much as you can, but dont go crazy. an ice cream a week isnt going to kill you. history & our capacity to utilize it is one of our greatest tools, dont let it go to waste. eating an all vegan diet, or all vegetarian diet is unhealthy, its unnatural & its a stupid egotistical idea, that humanity knows better than hundreds of millions of years of humanities natural evolution & existence.
I’m experimenting with the carnivore diet on myself. So far, I feel great. I have lost 35 lbs in 3 months and can tell my energy level is doing good. No more tiredness in the afternoon and I’m very sleepy at night. I go to bed earlier and sleep all night. I use to have moderate insomnia, so the sleep thing is a HUGE deal to me. I tried carnivore instead of WFPB because of life long digestive issues. I think eliminating sugar and junk food is the most important. Then experiment on yourself. Some people claim meat makes them feel bad, so I think they should eat what makes them feel good. Everyone is different but bad science that keeps someone from trying what works for them is, well, bad. And bad science that says harmful food is safe will hurt us too. All vegetable are not healthy, example spinch, and maybe fruit should be an occasional dessert.
Gluten is the Greek word for glue, break gluten down to the molecular structure is sugar now take sugar and mix it with water and do the same with salt, everytime the sugar in any case is sticky and won’t it do the same to your blood vessels and arteries? Very easy to understand it’s how thick headed you are to be in the heard mentality.
hmmm i eat a lot of fat but i am lean and fit . the people that moved to america got fat from all the pizza, soda, mcdonald-like food . they started to eat processed food. Eat whole foods, exercise, dont smoke, get your sleep, try to have low levels of stress and have a purpose in your life. if i eat a lot of ordered pizza i get fat in no time, if i drink coca cola i seem to lose my mental clarity because my body doesnt respond adequate to normal carbs.we have all seen these ex vegan stories now, its anecdotal but man its so obvious it is very risky to go vegan. Should you go carnivore?dont know, seems risky too to me. If you feel healthy and strong and look healthy and strong you must be doing something good. If you’re obese and out of breath from running a couple of miles, well… . If you perform well on a cognitive and physical level and have a healthy libido and look healthy, you ‘ll probably are fine.
My main question is how often do people actually use what they put into themselves/naturally produce? Yes saturated fat is horrible for you if you don’t use it. If you have cholesterol stuck in your veins it’s simply because it’s not being used. There isn’t anywhere else to store it in your body so it goes to your veins. You’d be fantastically surprised how fast your levels balance out when you hit a gym 5 days a week and how good you feel as well even when you hurt. Most people do not exercise with intensity or frequency and the obesity rating in America is evidence of that in and of itself. Hell, I was a part of that percentage before. 245lbs to be exact. Lost all 80lbs from genuine exercise. Ate real food and drank water mainly. I’m 170 (10lb muscle gain), 27, and healthier than I’ve ever been. Do I hurt? Sure. Exercise hurts. Do I feel better than I ever have even on my bad days? Yes. The bottom line that I see is most people do not use their body enough to balance out their diet and what their body naturally produces. I will say I do see bodybuilders passing early in age but the ones I’ve researched are on PEDS and eat a very high fat diet so there are a lot of variables in that mix.
If observational studies are junk science (mere association without causation, carrying no weight in Scientific research), why later in the debate does Chris say they should be factored into an analysis of all-cause mortality? Anyone? This has been nagging my mind ever since and I can’t post to Chris’s article on this debate because comments appear to be closed!
Theory…. We came from hunters and gathers.. meaning we didn’t have constant food. Now in society we have constant food. Food is energy and fuel for our muscles if we eat constantly but don’t expend all the energy we consume our body’s are over loaded with what it needs to function. Red meats and High fats are very Dense with energy and would therefore make sense to add fasting and smaller portions. Unlimited amounts of food with little to no energy expended leaves all that in your system and we continue to eat on top of that.
When you want to fatten an animal you feed it grain. Bread,noodles,other high carb foods contain mostly grain. So if you eat grain foods you will get FAT. My husband had very high cholesterol it was at one time over 1700. He later found out he had diabetes. Then he had esophageal cancer. When he was young he had indigestion took tums all day. Then he went to dr she prescribed acid lowering drugs. That’s when he got the esophageal cancer. He continued the acid lowering drug till he died. He never had a heart attack even with the extreme cholesterol. He even drank beer and smoked. No heart problems. So I dont think the high cholesterol has anything to do with heart attack. He did chemo, he threw up till he ended up in the ER with dehydration and had to be given IV fluid. He did chemo for about a year. Threw up till I thought he would drop dead in the bathroom. It was pure Hell. Hers what I think . His stomach didn’t have sufficient acid caused by a bad liver, caused by using drugs and drinking with a rotten diet as a young American man. The beer was made from grains. The drugs wear out the liver,the damaged liver caused the stomach to produce low acid which caused digestion to be no good. With a bad liver and a high sugar diet,bread beer and not enough veggies set up the damage to the liver. The damage liver caused diabetes. The crap that lowers stomach caused esophageal cancer. But the high carb,,grain fueled diet was the root source. So eat clean veggies and limit your drugs,all drugs and don’t smoke or drink alcohol and you might be safe from Doctors who throw drugs on every ailment known or unknown to man.
Listen, saturated fat is found in the arteries of people with heart disease. Saturated and trans fat is a problem. A serving of chips may contain 2grams of saturated fat, human eats an entire bag of chips, that’s 30-50 grams of saturated fat. Saturated fat is a long and sticky molecule (think of the long piece in Tetris except really sticky) this ends up in your blood and sticks to other fats and even calcium (which is a metal). It’s very common to find saturated fat stuck to calcium. So believe what you want but I am not okay with knowing that saturated fat and metal could be in my arteries. No thanks.
This guy arguing against plant based diets over the past couple of years, saying plant based is insufficient… meanwhile, I’m plant based with perfect bloodwork, intense kettlebell workouts shoulder pressing 32kg as a 175lb male, well being and health FAR superior to my coworkers who live on grassfed beef and deer they hunt… Just do what makes you happy… there isn’t a diet that’s best across the board. I’ll never be a 300lb strongman deadlifting 900lbs on plant based, and people on carnivore diet might be at a disadvantage in health… too much variance.
I think this is very clear. I higher educated more experienced person is debating to a less experienced/educated man. HOWEVER. The expert was thoroughly trained in medical science that has held a standard and position on a topic from the best possible research in the past. As American’s went low fat and continued to die, people began questioning the status quo- and the status quo is changing. This is being less researched by the other debater who is indoctrined into what was the top standard and may still have more evidence although that may be changing. I personally, will keep eating meats, greens and staying LEAN because I fear fat restriction will make me crave sugar and carbs which make me gain weight, have candida problems and make me hungrier.
It seems pretty obvious that if you have a gut, don’t exercise, smoke, or drink alcohol, you are going to die earlier than someone that is thin and doesn’t do all that other stuff. I mean, you can pretty much eat what you want if you go for a 10 km jog once a week or work out every day. Just stay healthy. When you reach your 60s or 70s and you can’t run, you better watch your diet and try to get some reps in somehow. Its usually when a man hits 60 that he starts to go downhill because he can’t exercise, retires from work, and has to be around his wife 24/7.
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